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Essay features of ancient greeks democracy
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There are many ancient political philosophers who have contributed to a large discussion on the issue of nature and convention. The relationship between the two can be seen in the writings of Plato and Aristotle among other ancient political philosophers. However, it should be duly noted how the first “historian” understood nature and convention in relation to each other. Thucydides provides a fascinating aspect of this relationship by having a very negative view of human nature and does so while trying to remain impartial and scientific (Ehrenberg 1968, 355). Throughout Thucydides’ works, it becomes evident of his belief that convention is needed to control nature because of the immense flaws of human nature.
To understand Thucydides, it is essential to first understand how he was attempting to write. He was writing the History of the Peloponnesian War in an effort to be objective, which could be compared to attempts by modern science. However, Thucydides’ accounts provide insight into his personal opinions that he held and viewed during this bloody war. His opinion of human nature becomes clear in the origins of the war, the Melian Dialogue, the plague, the Mytilenean Debate, the civil war at Corcyra, and the murder at Mycalessus. As one realizes Thucydides’ low view of man, it becomes obvious how this interacts with the question of the necessity of convention when interacting with nature. His views help to develop a variety of political realism that includes an understanding and appreciation for morality.
Thucydides’ Objectivity
One of the important aspects of Thucydides’ writings that needs to be understood to truly discover his position on this issue of nature and convention would be his unique writing style. He wrote diff...
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...ical Theory 27 (April): 435-466.
Saxonhouse, Arlene W. 1978. “Nature & Convention in Thucydides’ History.” Polity 10 (Summer): 461-487.
Thucydides. 1934. The Complete Writings of Thucydides: The Peloponnesian War. Trans. Joseph Gavorse. New York: Modern Library.
Thucydides. [1959] 1988. The Portable Greek Historians: The Essence of Herodotus, Thucydides, Xenophon, Polybius. Ed. M. I. Finley. New York: Penguin Books.
Thucydides. 2000. Readings in Classical Political Thought. Ed. Peter J. Steinberger and trans. Paul Woodruff. Indianapolis: Hackett Publishing Company.
Vickers, Michael. 1999. “Alcibaldes and Melos: Thucydides 5.84-116.” Historia: Zeitschrift für Alte Geschichte 48 (3): 265-281.
White, James Boyd. 1984. When Words Lose Their Meaning: Constitutions and Reconstitutions of Language, Character, and Community. Chicago, IL: The University of Chicago Press.
Throughout Aristophanes’ “Clouds” there is a constant battle between old and new. It makes itself apparent in the Just and Unjust speech as well as between father and son. Ultimately, Pheidippides, whom would be considered ‘new’, triumphs over the old Strepsiades, his father. This is analogous to the Just and Unjust speech. In this debate, Just speech represents the old traditions and mores of Greece while the contrasting Unjust speech is considered to be newfangled and cynical towards the old. While the defeat of Just speech by Unjust speech does not render Pheidippides the ability to overcome Strepsiades, it is a parallel that may be compared with many other instances in Mythology and real life.
The stunning Greek defeat of the Persians, the specter of which lurks behind the events of the Peloponnesian Wars, was for Herodotus proof of the superiority of Hellenic form of government and way of life, and Herodotus ends his history at this pinnacle of Greek history. Thucydides then accepts the task of chronicling Greece’s unraveling from a position as the dominant power of the Mediterranean, and a center of cultural, technological, and political development to the final result of the Peloponnesian Wars—a fractured, demoralized, and dependent Greece that lies wide open to foreign conquest. This result is, for Thucydides, apparent from the beginning of the conflict. Greece can only dominate when the balance of power between Athens and Sparta is maintained, and the destruction of either is tantamount to the destruction of the whole. An accurate understanding of the national characters of Athens and Sparta makes it clear which of the two will ultimately be the victor of a long, arduous military struggle, but the same understanding of national character makes it equally apparent that the one which can dominate militarily cannot lead Greece. The speeches made at the First Lacedaemonian Congress emphasize not only the character of the two nations in conflict, but more broadly, the inevitability of Hellenic demise as a result of this conflict.
Thucydides was right to claim that all wars can be explained by Fear, Honor, and Interest. All Wars are related to the three characteristics as stated by Dr. Nation (Dr. Nation video). The Athenians thought process was that the weak would be ruled by the strong and that was the nature of conflict (Strassler p. 43). Looking at the Peloponnesian war itself will illustrate how fear, honor and interest were involved with how this war developed. The initial unnamed Athenian that made that statement was probably using it to deter war with Sparta when it mostly incited the war (Dr. Nation Video). The Athenians wanted to maintain and sustain their city state but also expand it. They were expanding through their alliances and this is what invoked the
The Melian Dialogue is a debate between Melian and Athenian representatives concerning the sovereignty of Melos. The debate did not really occur-the arguments given by each side were of Thucydides own creation. Thus it is reasonable to assume that we can tease out Thucydides' own beliefs. In this paper, I will first extract Thucydides views from the Melian Dialogue and then analyze whether or not these views are well founded.
The major theme that comes out clearly in the text is the theme of warfare and glorious death. Right from the beginning of his book, Thucydides, writes the story of the war between the Athenians and the Spartans. The theme of warfare is therefore evidenced by the Athenians preparation, the author says, ‘…beginning at the moment that it broke out, and believing that it would be a great war and more worthy of relation than any other that had preceded.’ This shows that the war that was to start was a unique one that had never happened before in history, in Thucydides opinion. This to me shows a bit of an exaggeration but more importantly this dramatic portrayal of the Peloponnesian war shows that war was seen as a part of life in Athens. In the text, we don’t find Thucydides describing war as being dark, catastrophic, or destructive which is how we would depict war nowadays. Instead we find him describing the war as this huge event that will go down in history as the greatest war to be fought.
Thucydides, Dent, J. M., & Dutton, E. P. (1910). The Peloponnesian War. London & New
The causes of the Peloponnesian War proved to be too great between the tension-filled stubborn Greek city-states of Athens and Sparta. As Thucydides says in Karl Walling’s article, “Never had so many human beings been exiled, or so much human blood been shed” (4). The three phases of the war, which again, are the Archidamian war, the Sicilian Expedition and the Decelean war, show the events that followed the causes of the war, while also showing the forthcoming detrimental effects that eventually consumed both Athens and eventually Sparta effectively reshaping Greece.
Nardo, Don. The Ancient Greeks at Home and at Work. 1st ed. San Diego, CA: Lucent, 2004. Print.
In Plato’s The Republic, we, the readers, are presented with two characters that have opposing views on a simple, yet elusive question: what is justice? In this paper, I will explain Thrasymachus’ definition of justice, as well as Socrates’s rebuttals and differences in opinion. In addition, I will comment on the different arguments made by both Socrates and Thrasymachus, and offer critical commentary and examples to illustrate my agreement or disagreement with the particular argument at hand.
Pericles, in his Funeral Oration, asserts that the greatness of Athens exceeds that of all other Greek city states because of their richer and more developed culture, their superior and more impressive military, and their more advanced government and society. Each of these reasons will be addressed individually with heavy reference to the funeral oration of Pericles, recorded by Thucydides in his book, The History of the Peloponnesian War. The Peloponnesian War was a war fought between the two Greek city-states of Athens and Sparta with assistance from their respective allies. The war was very well documented, with a large portion of our knowledge today coming from Thucydides, an Athenian Historian who also served as an Athenian general
Thucydides recounts the events that took place during the civil war in Corcyra. In the year 427 tensions between the Democrats and Oligarchs exploded into civil war, both sides hailing allies from all over the world for aid. At first the Oligarchs received aid from large a Peloponnesian naval fleet, which gave the democrats a scare. However, the Democrats receive back up from an ever-larger Athenian fleet, sending the Democrats into a killing frenzy of all who supported the Oligarchy. Thucydides describes the situation during the civil war in Corcyra by saying that the citizens are sharply divided into two camps, consisting of Democrats on one side and Oligarchs on the other. There is a complete lack of trust on both sides and traditional values and social norms are being completely disregarded. As stated by Thucydides “In war, due to the availability of opportunity aggressiveness rises to the surface” (3.82),
Herodotus. “Greece Saved from Persian Conquest.” Readings in Ancient History. Eds. Nels M. Bailkey and Richard Lim. Boston: Houghton Mifflin Company, 2002.
Bowden, Hugh. "Thucydides, Pericles, and Periclean Imperialism." The International History Review 34, no. 3 (2012): 606-607.
Edwards, Mark. A Historical Introduction to the Iliad and the Odyssey. Newark, Del.: University of Delaware Press, 1981.
The Melian Dialogue bears a host of political interpretations as the Melians and Athenians negotiate the reality of power and rights of countries on the scale of empires. Though Cleomedes eventually relied on the heavy handed realist course of action in the Peloponnesian War, ideally, he could have cultivated a healthy respect for differing universal truths of political theories and the fluidity of interpretation in every text available to us today.